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from <album>Edit

i'm trying to get "this song is by X from Y" on the lyric page, but it keeps saying Y doesn't exist and is red. i'm inserting "{{Song|Y|X|star=Green}}" to the top of the lyric source. i've tried including and excluding the year from Y and it's definitely exists (ex. http://lyrics.wikia.com/The_World_Of_Skin:Please_Remember_Me ) so, what gives? -- Paradive (talk) 00:48, February 25, 2013 (UTC) paradive

In that case, it's showing up as red because the album page doesn't exist -- there isn't yet a page for Ten Songs from Another World (1990), or any of the other albums that are listed on the The World of Skin artist page. Album pages don't get created automatically, they need to be created by hand separately. Trainman (talk) 16:52, February 25, 2013 (UTC)
yes, there is. go to The World of Skin page, #4 is Ten Songs From Another World (1990). -- Paradive (talk) 05:19, February 28, 2013 (UTC) paradive
Yes -- as I said, the album is listed on the artist page, but there hasn't yet been a separate album page created for it. (You can tell because the link to the album is red on the artist page.)
The link at the top of the song page goes to the album page; if no album page has been created yet, the link will be red, which is what's happening in this case. Trainman (talk) 05:27, February 28, 2013 (UTC)
ugh. so how does one go about making/defining a page for the album? -- Paradive (talk) 23:44, March 1, 2013 (UTC) paradive
Same way you can create any page on the wiki: just click on the red link. It should automatically detect that you're trying to create an album page, and give you a template in the editing box. (Although first, what you might want to do is edit the artist page -- don't actually make an edit for now, just highlight the album track list and hit control-C. Then, when you create the album page, you can just do control-V and have the track list already done.) Trainman (talk) 00:39, March 2, 2013 (UTC)
now it's blue. did you do something?
my bad. still not working. -- Paradive (talk) 20:26, March 4, 2013 (UTC) paradive
Try "For" instead of "for" - pagenames are case sensitive. — 6×9 (Talk) 07:10, March 5, 2013 (UTC)
oooooooooohhhhhhhhhhh... thankee -- Paradive (talk) 23:35, March 6, 2013 (UTC) paradive

Lyrics of one album ON ONE PAGE please!Edit

I make a particular use of lyrics since I do not have wireless at home. I have to copy them and save them on my laptop. Thus it is a great loss of time to have to copy one song after the other ; why can't we see all the lyrics of one album on one page by clicking on the album's name? It sure would represent a loss in ad revenue, but a community project like Wikipedia should not be driven by revenue. Even for the average listener who is browsing "live", it would be more comfortable to have all the lyrics on the same page or at least click on an arrow to the next song. — The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.253.23.250 (talk).

Unfortunately, pages containing all the lyrics for an album would create a lot of duplication of songs that appear on more than one album, and thus, the potential for lyrics being corrected in one place but not in others (we don't have an automated way to duplicate lyrics). There also might be issues with Gracenote licensing, which happens on a song-by-song basis. Probably most importantly, though, I think most people who visit this site looking for lyrics are only looking for the lyrics to one song at a time, so it's more simple for them to have individual pages for each song.
That said, if you have ideas for how to handle the "click an arrow to the next song" method, such as a graphic mockup for how it would be presented on the song page, I'm sure we'd be interested in seeing them.
I also want to note that Wikia is not the same thing as Wikipedia (both entities will definitely tell you that!), and that the LyricWiki administrators don't do things for ad revenue-related reasons (we don't get any money for this) -- and most of the decisions on how LyricWiki is set up, including having separate pages for each song, were made years before it was a part of Wikia. Perhaps more than any other wiki being hosted by Wikia, though, LyricWiki can point to its ad revenue being necessary for the site to continue -- the ad revenue helps to pay for the Gracenote licensing, which keeps LyricWiki viable (that is, it keeps LyricWiki from being sued into oblivion for copyright infringement). Trainman (talk) 00:56, March 2, 2013 (UTC)
If you are willing to explain exactly what you are trying to do, there certainly is a way to do it. But expecting the universe of lw to change to fit your rather vague description is a bit unrealistic. ;)
Almost all of our users want the lyrics in the lyric box of their songs (in itunes or other media players). I have done what you want on rare occasions because an album was ripped from vinyl as one file per side, and I was too lazy to use a digital recorder to split the tracks.
I'd say step one would be to use your browser more efficiently, or use a browser than can be scripted.
A very similar question came up on this very portal around 4-5 years ago, some users even created a navigation template to move from song to song until they realized what sort of a quagmire they are getting themselves into, it was similar to wikipedia's album nav template. Maybe our template wizard knows what came of it ;) --ES (Talk) 11:18, March 3, 2013 (UTC)
Thank you for both your answers. What I had in mind did not involve suppressing the song-by-song pages, only having the option of seeing all the lyrics of the album by clicking somewhere on the album page. Which would also solve the ad revenue issue, since only a small amount of users would choose the option. However, I have no answer to the duplication and the licensing issues, which I had not envisaged in the first place.
I am actually very bad at informatics, so I have no suggestion regarding the "click to the next song" method. Hope someone else has :) (Someone else had indeed made the same proposal.)
Sorry for the inappropriate confusion with Wikipedia.
Since I am so bad at informatics, I would appreciate it if EchoSierra could tell me a bit more about "using the browser more efficiently" and "using a browser that can be scripted". Anyway, I will try to investigate in that way.
Thank you again, 80.14.89.196 10:24, March 5, 2013 (UTC)Gabriel
Just an information on the "next song" idea: Transclusion is able to implement such a feature, see Transclusion:Track 02 for example. It would also possible to setup aggregated lyric pages, but I think we may not provide something like this until there is a way to charge the fees for every song on the aggregated page, i. e. multiple "page view counter" triggers for one page. I'm not sure how the current system works, we'd have to inform about that first. - Chris 23:28, March 5, 2013 (UTC)
"I make a particular use of lyrics since I do not have wireless at home. I have to copy them and save them on my laptop." FYI if you install Songbird or Nightingale (free music players), you can retrieve the lyrics from the lyricwiki and store them into your MP3 file with the click of a button (if you have correctly tagged your MP3s). You can then view the lyrics in your music player, even when you are offline. Look for "lyrics plugin". Hmmm, I see the Nightingale website is down now, hopefully temporarily. Cheers, --MarjonW (talk) 16:29, October 23, 2013 (UTC)

Program for postingEdit

Hello, this is my small program for lyricWiki's posting. Please, test it and post your review. https://dl.dropbox.com/u/4105010/LyrWiki.exe

Vocaloid and UTAU and suchEdit

User:EchoSierra brought to my attention here that things could get confusing quickly with Vocaloid and UTAU artist pages around. (Vocaloid and UTAU are voice synthesizers. Vocaloid is commercial, UTAU is free software so there are literally infinite amount of voices/singers/voicebanks/whatever out there. No one knows exactly how many, but over 300 for sure...)Currently they're listed by "singer" in my category for them here. But apparently things can get weird, so maybe it would be better to list them as [[(Insert Producer Here):Song (feat. (Insert Vocaloid(s) Here)]]? Using Daniwell:Nyanyanyanyanyanyanya! as an example, maybe something like [[daniwell-P:Nyanyanyanyanyanyanya! (feat. 初音ミク)]] or something? And maybe the producer page can be sorted or something, I dunno. Definitely the producers have webpages and Twitter, that's solved. But then, most YouTube videos are reprints...

And because you can make any Vocaloid or UTAU cover any song, obviously Template:Covered and artist pages would get messy quickly. (Especially with UTAU... Imagine a song page with a covers list spanning the entire page...) And then, there are duets, and pairings and such someone put in a song, etc. So, what should be done? --ʃu126 02:58, March 17, 2013 (UTC)

Anyone? ^^;; --ʃu126
I guess most of us are out of our depth here -- I know I am :-) But I agree that having the producer (who does the actual work) as artist makes a lot more sense. Note that adding "(feat. XXX)" to the pagename is not permitted by LW:PN, but you can use the "fa=" parameter in {{Song}}, or we could create a {{VoiceSynth}} template which could take care of the categorising.
You could check which members of LW:Japan are still (somewhat) active and point them here, but I can't promise any of them are still around :-/ — 6×9 (Talk) 06:56, April 6, 2013 (UTC)
I left messages on the ones who have activity from at least February 2013. Waiting for a reply --[u126] 02:38, April 13, 2013 (UTC)
Here's some example files sitting on my computer: "【初音ミク】celluloid.mp3" by "baker feat. Hatsune Miku"; "【アコギ】ニコニコメドレ2.mp3" (アコギ, Akogi, Acoustic Guitar) by "Heppoko Rokugen Tsukai". For trio there's "【初音ミク、鏡音リン、鏡音レン】静かな湖畔 LIVE in 沖縄" (Shizuka na Kohan) without attributed artists (I should update these files). And then you have "Love is War - Miku,Kaito,Len,Rin,Gumi,Mikuo,Gakupo,Luka" for octets. I'd class the Vocaloids as more of an "instrument", much like "akogi" because I think that attributing Vocaloids as artist (prefix) is like attributing Pianos, Drums and Guitars as artists. Therefore, I also agree that producer should be used as artist. ..... As for covers list, how about "This song has been covered by Vocaloid/UTAU. For full list, see [[{{FULLPAGENAME}}/List_of_covers_using_Vocaloid_or_UTAU]]" on the covered song page? —BryghtShadow 03:48, April 13, 2013 (UTC)
Yeah, that sounds like a good idea :) But or producers with more than one name, like cosMo/BouSou-P and mothy/Akuno-P it should probably go under the name 初音ミク Wiki goes under? But then what should it be if it's different people tuning and writing the lyrics? Should it be [[{{LYRICIST}}:{{SONGTITLE}}]] or [[{{LYRICIST's TUNER}}:{{SONGTITLE}}]] And then for people that cover it with different lyrics?
I made a quick mockup of what I imagine here: User:Umbreon126/sandbox-vocaloidutau
Why does this have to be so complicated! --[u126] 22:21, April 13, 2013 (UTC)
Going with names that hmiku uses is probably a good idea. For tuner vs lyricist, I can't decide, but I'm leaning more towards tuner (composer or arranger?) for the original Vocaloid or UTAU song. As an example, the album Re:package by livetune. Looking at the song over16bit!, lyrics by "かじゅきP"(kajukiP) and "yae". but on the livetune blog entry, it's listed as "03.over16bit! (kajyuki)" (kajukiP was a member of livetune). So, we'd either use [[Livetune:Over16bit!]] or [[かじゅきP (kajukiP):Over16bit!]] I suppose? Another example is Stella > Rin(ぎん), which has lyrics by 良聖 and compose+arrange by Rin(ぎん). But then there's 鏡音レンの消失 > 妹P, which has lyrics by 妹P but compose+arrange by cosMo(暴走P) -- it's a parody of 初音ミクの消失 -DEAD END- by cosMo(暴走P).
While we're at it, for disambig tag what do we use? There's Fate (a Danish heavy metal band) and Fate (a Vocaloid song creator/maker/作り手). Do we just go with "Fate (JP)" (and assume/hope that Voicaloid artist names don't clash with JP artist names)? —BryghtShadow 03:04, April 18, 2013 (UTC)

┌─────────────┘ Maybe [[Fate (Vocaloid)]] for the disambiguation? unless there's a country planning to rename itselfI'm thinking more of lyricist for page titles because songs typically don't have a huge amount of lyricists (and I can't imagine such an idea going well) (for example Mr. Music, with 7 tuners, 3 lyricists, and 2 songwriters), or maybe even both lyricist and tuners. Maybe something like [[Kajuki-P and yae:Over16bit!]] or [[Kajuki-P & yae:Over16bit!]] (& or and???)? And while on the topic of livetune, it seems hmiku doesn't have one page for livetune, so maybe there could be an artist page [[livetune]] that lists all the members? For parodies, maybe the person that revised everything and made the parody... --[u126] 23:28, April 21, 2013 (UTC)

The issue here is that VY1 & Category:Voice Synthesizer/Vocaloid/VY2 are not artists, any more than EMS VCS 3 Wikipedia16 that Pink Floyd used was an artist. Please see Bplats Wikipedia16, creators of VY1 & VY2 etc. In a similar vein, Mac OS Wikipedia16 has many built in voices for text to speech conversion (Victoria, Bruce, etc.), but neither Bruce or Victoria or MacOS are artists.
However, behind all pieces of software and hardware, a human sits (maybe a technician on behalf of a studio, or an individual we can call an artist) who controls the hardware and software, supplies the lyrics/text (existing or original work).
Again to draw another analogy, cartoon characters like 大谷智哉 (Tomoya Ohtani) or Rocky & Bullwinkle or Snowy White (+ seven dwarfs) are not artists. Behind all of these ficticious characters sits one or more humans who bring the characters to life.
Seems like the best way to represent VY1 & VY2 is by albums, with the artist of each song being an entity that certainly is not VY1 VY2 or any future incarnations / combinations of hardware & software.
Additionally, neither VY1 nor VY2 has any external references of any sort declared, because none exists. --ES (talk) 02:58, May 2, 2013 (UTC)
"Seems like the best way to represent VY1 & VY2 is by albums, with the artist of each song being an entity that certainly is not VY1 VY2 or any future incarnations / combinations of hardware & software." If you mean that songs should be listed as [[{{artist(not VY1 or VY2)}}:SongTitle}}]], that's what we're talking about above, debating how it should be set out. I certainly agree that VY1 and VY2 are not exactly entirely artists, but when I first stumbled across this Wiki, I found the Category:Voice Synthesizer/Vocaloid/初音ミク (Miku Hatsune) page, then 鏡音リン・レン (Rin & Len Kagamine) and assumed that was how it was set out, because it was there xP
Obviously now that is not correct, and it's a complex issue, and I think it would be nice to have some admin input of some sort on how it should all be solved.
Also, VY1 at Vocaloid Wiki and VY2 at Vocaloid Wiki. --[u126] 22:24, May 2, 2013 (UTC)
There is a reason why we have ArtistFooeter external refrences: If we follow the mb link at Category:Voice Synthesizer/Vocaloid/初音ミク (Miku Hatsune), and inspect the albums attributed, it will become clear that Hastsune is not an artist, rather a featured piece of equipment by artists as listed at 初音ミク@mb. At :Category:Voice Synthesizer/Vocaloid/初音ミク (Miku Hatsune) Wikipedia16 we learn it's a piece of software, and that 1000s of songs have been written for it (by artists, I imagine). Also see Miku Hatsune@discogs
I'd be the first to admit we have bad examples all over the site, 大谷智哉 (Tomoya Ohtani) artist page is another one I mentioned earlier, songs with misattribution of artist to Musicals/TV shows/Movies/Disney/Cartoon charcters are other examples. If you read the VY1 & VY2 wikis you refrenced, maybe the fog of marketing complexity will disappear ;) --ES (talk) 23:51, May 2, 2013 (UTC)
I understand that they're not artists, if that's what you mean. (I just made the pages in the past because of the existing pages, and the assumption of "OK, this is how it goes I guess".) I love MusicBrainz's tag "bogus artist" --[u126] 01:48, May 3, 2013 (UTC)

Two different artists with same nameEdit

Hey! I would like to make a page for the Japanese band Raphael. Unfortunatly there already exists a Spanish artist with the same name ( Raphael ). So, how should this be solved? I know that last.fm solves it by letting both artist share the page. Is that how it is solved here as well? It might get kind of confusing though.. --XeonpZycho (talk) 10:08, April 17, 2013 (UTC)

See LW:PN. See also relevant discussion: User talk:6 times 9#Foggy Skies at Amazon. Hope that helps. —BryghtShadow 03:27, April 18, 2013 (UTC)
Great! I thought I looked everywhere before posting, but it seems I missed that one! Thanks! I already got help by EchoSierra who set up the new artist page, so I'm rockin' it now!--XeonpZycho (talk) 07:34, April 18, 2013 (UTC)

Is there an easy way to move a whole bunch of songs off onto another artist page? I've noticed that on Sia's page there are a bunch of songs under 'Other Songs' with spanish titles that belong to someone else who apparently goes by Sia as well.. but I can't really find any information about this "spanish Sia" --ManChicken (talk) 07:16, December 23, 2013 (UTC)

Tags for songs!Edit

Let's add tags for song based on, for example, meaning, theme of lyrics (I guess, it will be main way of using, but there is also could be more reasons.) For instrumentals — some kind of description, mood … whatever. Probably, it's like it was done on LastFm. Please note, that it's not only methodical, it's technical question firstly. Трамвай Ядерный (talk) 09:16, June 2, 2013 (UTC)

Proposal to Change Policy for Root PagesEdit

There's a whole lot of lyrics in the world that cannot simply be listed under PERFORMER:NAME OF SONG. These songs are often in the public domain, but this is an issue with many other song types, too. Currently, not being allowed to list songs in other ways (such as by lyricist or composer) on LW is a problem. Many contributors would like to create root pages for these songs, but if they look up the current LyricWiki:Page Names they cannot find any help about how to handle these specific songs or works of music. This leads to a huge mess in naming pages, listing songs, and referring to original works. It also makes it quite hard to find original versions of widely covered songs. This is especially true for musical plays.

This is why we consider it necessary to agree on a slightly expanded LyricWiki:Page Names and establish a system of root pages, that enables us to properly refer to original works. Changes would have to be documented in the LyricWiki:Page Names as well as in the help pages.

We now present our proposal how this could be done with only minimal adaptation of template behaviour, and we would like to discuss this with the LW community. Our goal is to finally set up a road map and set the changes into motion.

Please note that we would like to discuss the issue exclusively on the talk page of our proposal.

Arwen4CJ Talk  · Lichtweber talk service  20:46, October 18, 2013 (UTC)

bop.fm widgetEdit

Wikia has decided to partner with bop.fm to build a widget into each page which will stream the songs, free & legal. Just thought I'd give you the background-info before it shows up :)
Once it's up, we should probably decide whether it's redundant with the youtube embeds or not.
-Sean Colombo (talk) 21:24, December 3, 2013 (UTC)

Discogs artist linksEdit

Looks like discogs.com finally decided to switch to IDs for artists as well. Thankfully they did it in a way that no change to the template is necessary, and the old links still work (e.g. http://www.discogs.com/artist/Pink+Floyd now redirects to http://www.discogs.com/artist/45467-Pink-Floyd), though who knows for how long… I've updated template documentation and artist help page. — 6×9 (Talk) 09:30, December 21, 2013 (UTC)