From LyricWiki

Contents 1 Flag needed 2 Changes in iTunes Link Maker? 3 Pagetitle 4 Omniscience? 5 The Killers:Not True 6 Very weird... 7 Twitter userbox 8 Editing War 9 I dunno 10 LyricWiki Suite Update

Talk Page Archives: 2008: Jul–Nov • Dec 2009: Jan • Feb • Mar • Apr (The Party) • May • Jun • Jul • Aug • Sep • Oct-Nov

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[edit] Flag needed

So that if someone forgets to delete {{SongFooter}} on translated sub page, the page doesn't get addded inappropriately to Category:Pages Needing Song Template, i.e. [1]  ♫_♫Яєd_{xx ♪}♫♪_♫♪ ^Actions _Words 04:37, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

The proper way to remove them from the category is not to change the template, but to delete the SongFooter. This way we can at least find these pages (though we'll miss those with both templates still present). — 6×9 (Talk) 05:16, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

The last argument you brought up yourself is why I think it might really be more helpful to create categories. The {{SongFooter}} could easily be adjusted using your {{#vardefine:translation|1}} in the {{TranslatedSong}} template, it then would look like this:

(old code)...#if:{{NAMESPACE}}||{{
#if:{{#var:translation}}|{{
#ifeq:{{#var:pagetype}}|Song|[[Category:Song Templates on Translation Page]]|[[Category:SongFooter on Translation Page]]}}|{{
#ifeq:{{#var:pagetype}}|Song||[[Category:Pages Needing Song Template]]}}}}{{
#if:{{{wikipedia|}}}...(old code)

You know which part I mean? Exactly puts wrong pages either into Category:Pages Needing Song Template or Category:SongFooter on Translation Page respectivly even into Category:Song Template on Translation Page. - Chris 21:45, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

The last one is better off in {{TranslatedSong}} I think… lets us find those without SF as well. (Good idea! Just added it.)

The reason I didn't split the first two up in SF wasn't (solely) laziness, but economy: a template that's used on 10^5s of pages shouldn't be more complex than strictly necessary. We've had some weird issues in the past (pre-Move), like album pages not appearing in an artist's WLH, or songs dropping out of language categories, which I suspected were due to the (relatively) complex code. I suppose I should have renamed the cat to something more fitting though, like "SongFooter without Song Template". — 6×9 (Talk) 06:44, November 11, 2009 (UTC)

PS. Throwing up in categories??? Yuck! Someone get The Cleaner! — 6×9 (Talk) 09:02, November 11, 2009 (UTC)

"The proper way to remove them from the category is not to change the template, but to delete the SongFooter.". Yes, that is how to remove them, which is of course exactly what I have done. But I am not talking about fixing the results of the problem. I am talking about actually solving the problem. Removing them is not solving the problem. The category (and by it's inclusion the song page) indicates to users that they need to add a Song template. So one user comes along and removes it. The next one adds it. The next one removes it, etc. These translation sub pages should not be included in that category is what I meant.  ♫_♫Яєd_{xx ♪}♫♪_♫♪ ^Actions _Words 11:14, November 11, 2009 (UTC)

I doubt that'll happen (else we'd be constantly cleaning out the category). The user who removes it knows it doesn't belong there and in all likelihood will also remove the Footer. But like I wrote above, the category name is misleading, and the best option IMO is to choose a more fitting name. — 6×9 (Talk) 11:39, November 11, 2009 (UTC)

Great. Category:Song Template on Translation Page suddenly filled up overnight… but none of the first few pages I checked had a song template! So I did null edits to a few – and they disappeared again, like I expected. I guess variables and categories really don't like each other. — 6×9 (Talk) 06:55, November 13, 2009 (UTC)
PS. Using "?action=purge" is not sufficient, I have to actually edit & save. Pity…

Ask Senv to touch the pages with Lwt? Maybe this works? - Chris 12:35, November 13, 2009 (UTC)

; PagesInCat: 874->12. --Senvaikis ^(talk) 13:52, November 13, 2009 (UTC)

…and from 12 to 0. Thanks, Senv! — 6×9 (Talk) 17:26, November 13, 2009 (UTC)

He's a good lad is our Senv ;)  ♫_♫Яєd_{xx ♪}♫♪_♫♪ ^Actions _Words 19:30, November 13, 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Changes in iTunes Link Maker?

Have you noticed that iT link, generated by current iTLM, and it's description in our help and {{ArtistFooter}} docs particulary, doesn't match anymore?

Compare:

• Help: http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewArtist?id=abdf56d (put only the part in bold)
• iTLM: http://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/<artist-name>/idabdf56d

That wouldn't be worth to mention, if all *f.iTs were working. But I just found several cases (10_K.A.N.'s, 100._Debija) with af.iT's, filled perfectly but leading to some strange xml error pages. Remembering those "invalid" 3-dots-@start-pages, I'm not sure if these links aren't working only for me again, or we have some iTLM bug here. Question was inspired by Lwt, after walking through af-asin, akuma & mb, now champing at the bit to make the same on af.iT. --Senvaikis ^(talk) 20:37, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

Yep, I'd noticed. It started a few days ago, I think. At first the links still worked, but a few hours ago I tried to add some album itunes, and the links only led me to the generic "trying to find itunes" page. I'm afraid we might need to adjust the templates… I'd better let Sean know. — 6×9 (Talk) 20:42, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

Ok, I'll try to slow down the eagerness of Lwt then :)--Senvaikis ^(talk) 21:23, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

You don't need the artist-name, http://itunes.apple.com/artist/id324906440 is enough to work - Chris 21:01, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

Are you speaking this to me? :),--Senvaikis ^(talk) 22:43, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

Hey hey, I didn't know that page existed ;) Cool thing, although I don't quite get what you want to show with it. You want to visit all the pages and update the parameters? I just wanted to point out that no changes in the parameters are needed to get the links back to work again.- Chris 13:20, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

What I wanted to show:

1. LW documentation must be changed - it doesn't match format of link, produced by current iTLM
2. Templates, producing iT links are based on old iTLM format and might be changed too
3. If we decided to change templates, then some additional unification would be possible, removing uninformative parts of *f.iT parameters, as was done with af.asin & *.f.akuma

--Senvaikis ^(talk) 16:37, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Pagetitle

Hey, thanks for fixing my half-assed work on the pagetitle! I was talking to Sean about ways to help the wiki get better Google ranking, and that was one part of it -- if somebody's looking for "Britney Spears lyrics", then they'll find us easier if that's the beginning of the pagetitle. But it was a half-assed job, because there were pages where it doesn't really work. Your solution is very clever and makes it work the way I'd wanted it to. You're a genius, thanks! -- Danny (talk) 22:25, November 13, 2009 (UTC)

Many of our templates use the if:namespace thingie to keep documentation, help pages etc. out of categories, so it's pretty much become second nature for me :-) — 6×9 (Talk) 09:17, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

Genuis eh? Like I already told them of course.

Anyway, considering you are such a genuis, fixing this should be a piece of cake for you.  ♫_♫Яєd_{xx ♪}♫♪_♫♪ ^Actions _Words 12:45, November 14, 2009 (UTC) P.S. I couldn't find where the template is lurking, otherwise I would probably have fixed it myself.

Yep, I'm a geniune genuis ;-) So can I have my piece of cake now? — 6×9 (Talk) 13:04, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

Thank you X  ♫_♫Яєd_{xx ♪}♫♪_♫♪ ^Actions _Words 15:56, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Omniscience?

Are you stalking me, do you have the uncanny ability to be online whenever I'm online, or are you just omnipresent\omniscient? Seems like every time I've been on here in the last few days you've been online at the same time, ready to jump in and fix my mistakes :) ; even going so far as to remove that URL on the Wikipedia Monofader page, I noticed, which I went back to do myself but you were too quick. Sticky 11:33, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

Just coincidence, I promise! (Red is the omnipresent one… and my own personal stalker.) As for the URL… most of the times I just copy them over from Wikipedia without checking, sadly. But since you had already diligently filled in most other parameters I thought there must be a reason why you left it blank. I deleted it from the WP page mainly so that another user (or bot) wouldn't do what I normally do and copy it over… — 6×9 (Talk) 11:41, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

Haa haa  ♫_♫Яєd_{xx ♪}♫♪_♫♪ ^Actions _Words 13:23, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

[edit] The Killers:Not True

Hi, You stated on the edit summary for the above article/lyric page that: "{{{1}}}" is not a sufficient reason for deletion. I apologise, I must not have formatted correctly as I am new to tagging articles for deletion. This is also why I left the reason for nominating for deletion in the edit summary as opposed to in the article/talk page. I shall state the full reason here so you know why and take the relevant action:

• In my opinion it most definitely is not a Killers song as I have been following them since the very beginning and it has never been performed live nor been released (as a demo, b-side, rarity, bonus track, cover, etc).[2]
• Google search throws up the same set of lyrics on several lyric sites, but note that they've all been copied word for word from one source (including the typo "rewond")[3]
• Reliable popular lyrics site such as songmeanings.net (which has feedback for every song, as opposed to the above) does not list it
• It has only 1 listener and 37 plays (for a 32 second track) on the entire last.fm network [4]
• No footage of such a performance or music video on youtube or google video [5]
• The administrator on the official Killers forum (Hermia) states that "this is not [by] The Killers. It's another band from another country with a similar name".[6]

I hope this clears things up on why this needs to be deleted. Feudonym 10:14, November 16, 2009 (UTC)

There are two problems with deleting it: (1) The page was created by ÜberBot, a bot who occasionally fetches lyrics from other sites, so if I deleted it, ÜB would just re-create it during its next run. (2) The song apparently does exist, just not by this band, so the proper procedure would be to move it to the correct page. Since I couldn't find out the correct artist I moved it to Unknown Artist instead. — 6×9 (Talk) 07:16, November 18, 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Very weird...

I really can't remember doing this. It doesn't even make sense to me.

And I know you are just being plain awkward ;P but can you please give some input to the discussion going on between Chris and Chris at the bottom of my talk page. Only I don't know about King (because he is of course much more intelligent than me) but the dear boy has totally lost me.  ♫_♫Яєd_{xx ♪}♫♪_♫♪ ^Actions _Words 02:20, November 18, 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Twitter userbox

Thanks for the update to the Twitter userbox -- making my quick-and-dirty creation a little less quick and dirty. Trainman 14:48, November 25, 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Editing War

Please stop this editing war on Ali Project page. Is there some sort of new rule that requires all the translated lyrics to be redirected to a new page? But transliteration is not really translating. And it is kind of helpful to have transliteration next to the translation... Iatheia 22:57, November 29, 2009 (UTC)

Yes, there is a new rule. :) Now you use {{TranslatedSong|en|roman|etc}} to add the translated lyrics. If you can't find a suitable name for transliteration it can be added at the template such as "roman" for "romanized". PS. Also additional albums are added with album2=/album3= at {{Song}} or {{Additional Albums}} and not 2 or 3 different templates.Titaki 10:50, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, Titaki! Please also note that you can still have original/transliteration/translation side-by-side, just on the transl(iter)ation subpage instead of the original song page. See Ali Project:桃色天国/roman and …en for examples. — 6×9 (Talk) 18:48, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

[edit] I dunno

I leave you alone for two or more weeks and it's the same old story..I come back to find you have been upsetting all our users. You evidently need me more than you think you do :-)

Anyway. I'm hoping all is well with you of course. I'm still suffering (well it is winter you know) so I've not really committed to much these past few weeks. However, in between times I did decide to do this. I guess I must be learning something if I'm starting to have a conscience about leaving code as it is that works out Ok (display wise), when I know that this is simply a "happy little accident" (RIP Bob Ross) (i.e. the code is wrong). There's still lots that gets me scratching my head (no I haven't got nits), but I think you'll agree that I'm starting to get the hang of it. Have I missed any major updates or anything?  ♫_♫Яєd_{xx ♪}♫♪_♫♪ ^Actions _Words 18:05, December 9, 2009 (UTC)

Oh dear. Where to start... I'm already getting a headache just from looking at the page, I don't think I could stomach the source code. (Plus, I'm pretty short on time these days.) What do I have to pay you to leave at least my userpage alone? ;-) — 6×9 (Talk) 15:43, December 11, 2009 (UTC)

Well you could always try what Notime2cry's done and erect a "No Meddling Zone" sign. But since that only lasted until I saw that it needed some explanatory hover text, I don't give a lot for your chances :-).

"Pretty short on time these days...". You do this deliberately, don't you? Mmmmmm...a priest?

 ♫_♫Яєd_{xx ♪}♫♪_♫♪ ^Actions _Words 17:02, December 11, 2009 (UTC) P.S. Category:Userboxes/Nationality & Template:Userboxes/Hometown

A priest??? You must be getting desperate. Sorry, gotta go, can't find the incense… — 6×9 (Talk) 13:46, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Grrr..so was I more right with my first guess? You are a student, yes? Studying a form of medicine? Do you ever get beyond first names on first dates? Rfl. Useless fact number 153: My first internet best bud was a satanist from Denmark.  ♫_♫Яєd_{xx ♪}♫♪_♫♪ ^Actions _Words 14:44, December 13, 2009 (UTC)

[edit] LyricWiki Suite Update

Hey 6, I just want to let you know there's a new version of LWS, now with Last.fm and Wikipedia as sources for PreCoder, the Time Adding feature included, template-updates payed attention to and some minor things corrected.

Just in case you might be interested =) - Chris 12:00, December 12, 2009 (UTC) P.S.: Did you know, today's your 527^th day at LyricWiki so you do 152.38 edits per day? ;) (I've scripted some code to display that^^)

The edit count is off – before the Move it was > 400,000. That number wasn't accurate either, though; I suspect page moves were counted twice. And I did a lot of those via batchmove => lotsa edits with little work!

Cool! I quickly tested the precoder with Wikipedia (works, but the tracklist I used had ” instead of " so I had to search'n'replace first… not a problem though, since most pages use straight quot. marks anyway. Automated length adding is great!) and MusicBrainz (it leaves the track length, so I get "Artist:Song Title 1:23"… You could do one better than Wikifyer by allowing unknown lengths "?:??" as well). WatchDoc is a cool idea, but it doesn't like unicode – some Cyrillics got converted to "?" you can't blame Win98 either, since I'm on XP now ;-) . Good work though! — 6×9 (Talk) 12:54, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Could you give me the Wikipedia and MB sourcepages you used?

1. It's no problem for me to replace smart-quotes with straight quotes in the programm before recognition starts.
2. I tested MB-parsing again for an album by Splodgenessabounds and couldn't reproduce the time error. What you see on the page is original PreCoder output (except for the Genre and ASIN on the album page), copied from here (select everything from "1" in the top-left to "4:44" in the bottom-right-corner of the table)
3. What do you mean by "allowing" ?:?? lengths? You mean, it should summarize the length although not all are known?

Unfortunately I cannot "extend" character support AFAIK to any character. I'll test it though.

Thank you for your quick report! - Chris 14:56, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Aaaah I found the reason for length in trackname. It's an issue if the table is copied with the Internet Explorer. I'll change it soon. - Chris 15:16, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

I used [7] and [8] for testing. RE "?:??" – not all MB album pages have tracklengths, those that don't show the ?:?? placeholder in the right column.

Hmmm, I copied the MB tracklist from IE into a text editor – there were 5 space char.s between title and length. I replaced these with tabs – didn't help either. Which delimiter does the precoder expect (out of curiosity)? — 6×9 (Talk) 15:40, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Firefox displays the times even in their own lines, and that was the problem: I didn't know browsers parse HTML-tables into text formats using own rules. I thought the result would only depend on the original source-code. However it's fixed, download LWS again.

The same error occurred for Opera (which is fixed as well now), and tests with Safari made up perfect results, too.

Quote problem is solved now, PreCoder changes ” to " and ’ to ' - Chris 15:51, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Wow, that was fast! Thanks! Any chance the precoder could ignore the "is covered by…" bits as well? I'm getting [[Brian Eno:The Secret Place Is Covered By The Secret Place By DarXtra|… (Though that might get complicated, if other browsers give different delimiters for these as well. Where's the W3C when you need them?) — 6×9 (Talk) 17:36, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Just see where wanting something can get you 6? I got what I wanted and a hell of a lot more besides! Again Chris - very well done. I've asked Sean to take a look at LWS and respond to you directly (but bear in mind he is extremely busy at the moment). It's also great that you and Senv talk the same language and can assist each other with programming projects. I told you Senv was a great guy. Now you know it too. It is a good day :-)  ♫_♫Яєd_{xx ♪}♫♪_♫♪ ^Actions _Words 14:42, December 13, 2009 (UTC)